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    News

    Pace Partner Route Rotation Announced

    Eric Schlange
    By Eric Schlange
    March 26, 2021
    LAST UPDATED March 26, 2021
    43

    Since their release in late August 2020, Pace Partners have become a popular feature on Zwift – an always-on group ride which sticks to a consistent pace.

    They were expanded to include the Drops Multiplier game in October 2020, rolled out to runners in December 2020, and have been steadily tweaked in each month’s updates to further improve the user experience.

    This week Zwift quietly announced another update to the cycling Pace Partners – route rotation!

    Up to this point, each Pace Partner has basically stayed on the same route (with very occasional deviations surprising everyone because they weren’t shown in the drop-in screen.) Now the drop-in screen appears to accurately show which route the Pace Partner is actually on, and according to Zwift’s post, the Pace Partners are rotating routes on a weekly basis:

    Pace PartnerRoute Set 1Route Set 2Route Set 3
    A. AnquetilRoad to RuinsDust In the WindBig Foot Hills
    B. BrevetSand and SequoiasFigure 8Out and Back Again
    C. CadenceTempus FugitTick TockSand and Sequoias
    D. DieselFlat RouteVolcano FlatWatopia’s Waistband

    Notes

    • Each Pace Partner’s routes have a similar elevation-to-distance ratio as their original routes (except C. Cadence, whose new routes are a bit more climby than her original pan-flat Tempus Fugit route)
    • Route changes will occur on Monday mornings between 4-5am UTC. Use this handy site to convert to your local time zone

    Currently the Pace Partners are set to Route Set 2, which means next week they should be on Route Set 3.

    Your Thoughts

    Do you like the idea of the Pace Partners rotating routes? What do you think of the route choices? Chime in below! (You might also want to share your feedback on the Zwift forum post.)

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      Eric Schlange
      Eric Schlangehttp://www.zwiftinsider.com
      Eric runs Zwift Insider in his spare time when he isn't on the bike or managing various business interests. He lives in Northern California with his beautiful wife, two kids and dog. Follow on Strava

      43 COMMENTS

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      43 Comments
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      Evan
      Evan
      2 years ago

      Good to see some variation! I was getting bored of Tempus Fugit…

      5
      Reply
      ShakeNBakeUK
      ShakeNBakeUK(@bakeuk)
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Evan

      you mean ur not just looking at drop counter? D:

      8
      Reply
      Joel
      Joel
      2 years ago

      I suspected it was only a matter of time before they did this! I also think it would be interesting to see them implement one of two related ideas. First longer routes such the ones you are doing on the Badge Hunter Series with known times (that rotate of course to accommodate for different time zones) and second letting you know where they are in relation to the course “start”. Major difficulty with this is that I think the routes have to be loops so they are not interrupted. Any ideas?

      2
      Reply
      Mick Such
      Mick Such
      2 years ago

      Always found Dan to be Sooooo SLOW up hills out of tunnels n after sprint. Then he up gear n explodes through the esses. Really strange. Will be nice to have the route change. Yeah the desert was getting a bit boring.

      3
      Reply
      Crankenstein
      Crankenstein
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Mick Such

      The pace partners keep an exact wattage target while they ride. It’s incredibly unnatural if you are used to riding with groups on smart trainers who will push uphill and back off downhill. Dan feels like the worst given his wattage is fairly low (125w iirc). Next time you ride with him try turning your trainer difficulty to zero, or watch him riding. Uphill everyone will tend to get ahead while downhill he will typically fly by everyone unless they are also maintaining a relatively constant power output; removing hill simulations makes it a lot easier to follow. It would… Read more »

      2
      Reply
      Bob
      Bob(@stephenrellis)
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Crankenstein

      “Dan … his wattage is fairly low (125w iirc).”

      Yes, 123 (1.5 w/kg * 82 kg)

      0
      Reply
      Buzz
      Buzz(@jimbo_jim007)
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Crankenstein

      Yes depending how steep the hill is, it can be hard to even push 125w on a descent with 53/11. Most realistically would suit if slowed down output on descents and stayed for flats and hills at their set wattage. Just my thoughts. At least it’s a start! And it probably makes sense to punch the climb a bit higher so you don’t get overtaken by the pace partner on the descent.

      0
      Reply
      Andrew Leeds
      Andrew Leeds
      2 years ago

      Shame there hasn’t been another one added between c and d groups, in % terms it’s just too big a jump, perhaps higher groups c to b, b to a the % jump is either manageable/ more suitable, but for me, d is way to slow, zone 1 (or 2) and c to much, either at or over threshold. So not a “pace partner” at all, either a recovery ride or a ftp effort.

      42
      Reply
      Richard Goris
      Richard Goris
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Andrew Leeds

      Excellent point. I agree.

      4
      Reply
      Amber
      Amber
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Andrew Leeds

      Same experience for me.

      4
      Reply
      Terry Rawlinson
      Terry Rawlinson
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Amber

      I had a chat with one of the Zwift ride leaders and there are plans to bring in an E Catergory Bot, was told to watch that space but as yet nothing

      4
      Reply
      Dan Neesley
      Dan Neesley
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Terry Rawlinson

      That would be really great. I’m old and slow and wouldn’t struggle as much as I do with Diesel Dan.

      0
      Reply
      Greg
      Greg
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Andrew Leeds

      When my wife rides with C, she just drops her weight for that session so that she can keep up at a reasonable power, very easy to change just for that session. She changes it back for normal rides. Just a suggestion

      4
      Reply
      Kevin
      Kevin
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Andrew Leeds

      Try riding the mountain bike with the D partner .. the lack of drafting makes it a bit harder

      1
      Reply
      Eric Schlange
      Author
      Top Member
      Eric Schlange(@eschlange)
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Kevin

      But mountain bikes still draft, Kevin! It’s the Crr that makes it harder: https://zwiftinsider.com/crr

      6
      Reply
      Joel
      Joel
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Kevin

      When riding with DD I actually enjoy riding with a TT bike do I don’t have to manage the draft effects. It makes me work a bit harder but not as hard as BB or CC groups when I’m drafting.

      0
      Reply
      Spinmonkey
      Spinmonkey(@geoffspinmonkey)
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Andrew Leeds

      I agree and have given that feedback after every ride. Gap between Dan and Coco is too great. Should be a 1.5 2.0 and 2.5wkg bots

      3
      Reply
      Richard Goris
      Richard Goris
      2 years ago

      Excellent idea with the rotation! Zwift programmers are doing a great job. Love Zwift!!

      4
      Reply
      Paul Himes
      Paul Himes
      2 years ago

      Last night Coco Cadence was doing the Watopia Hilly Route Reverse even though it was listed as Tick Tock on the sign in screen, so it’s not completely bug-free yet.

      4
      Reply
      Paul Himes
      Paul Himes
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Paul Himes

      Honestly, I wish they would leave something running Tempus Fugit at 2.5 W/kg all the time (introduce a new pace partner?) because that was perfect for pre-race warmup. The new routes give variability which is nice if you’re using them for a ride, but, when I’m warming up for a race, I don’t want to find myself going up the Watopia Hilly KoM reverse like I did last night.

      5
      Reply
      Darin Boyd
      Darin Boyd
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Paul Himes

      I think the interesting thing about the pace partners is that they are actually easier to stay with at advertised pace on a climb then on the flat or downhill. They don’t have that inherent inevitable need that seemingly EVERY Zwifter that has ever lived to add at least a full w/kg as soon as they see 2%+ in that top right hand corner!! That being said they can still be effected by the draft of said Zwifters that still succumb to that urge!

      5
      Reply
      Crankenstein
      Crankenstein
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Darin Boyd

      Do you ride with a smart trainer Darin? I think the wattage increases you see are typically due to automated increases in resistance for other riders, who might try to adjust to hills via cadence rather than gear shifts (or not at all). If you’re lazy about that you will definitely increase wattage uphill even with a reduced trainer difficulty level.

      You’re not wrong though, it can be aggravating, especially on rides that advertise averages close to your threshold power. One longish hill and you will get dropped like a bad date.

      1
      Reply
      Gary Crays
      Gary Crays
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Paul Himes

      Yeah, Coco seems buggy and some of my other Zwift friends have seen the same thing. Yesterday I was doing Tick Tock with Coco and 20 minutes later she was gone, only to re-appear 5 minutes later and then disappear again. Someone messaged a few minutes later that Coco was on a different course.

      1
      Reply
      anderfo
      anderfo
      2 years ago

      The “choose a pace partner” dialog should indicate the rider’s weight, which tells us more about how he/she moves… I read somewhere on the support forum that D.Diesel and B.Brevet are 82 kg and A.Anquetil and C.Cadence are 65 kg. But when I actually try to ride with them, it feels like D.Diesel is more in the 100-120 kg range since he’s speeding up like crazy on every small downhill and nearly stopping completely on uphills. It doesn’t really fit with the steady W/kg reported through the Rider list on the right… The bots are listed with a W/kg range,… Read more »

      3
      Reply
      Darin Boyd
      Darin Boyd
      2 years ago
      Reply to  anderfo

      it’s a lot less erratic with Coco than the D guy, but one thing that does happen to effect what you describe is that the pace partners do stay at advertised pace, whereas EVERY real Zwifter naturally ramps up the power at the first hint of a grade and conversely tend to back off/sit up, on descents.

      3
      Reply
      Jonathan
      Jonathan
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Darin Boyd

      Right, they advertise the W/kg as a range, so it seems like it would make sense to move to the upper end of the range on the climbs and the lower end of the range on the descents, like real riders do. Seems like a no-brainer to implement, and it would make the pacing a lot more realistic.

      5
      Reply
      Bob
      Bob(@stephenrellis)
      2 years ago
      Reply to  anderfo

      I suspect that Dan Diesel’s speed variations have more to do with the effect of draft on his speed — sometimes he may be held back by draft lock, and other times propelled forward by the draft created by others in the group speeding up, or by a faster group passing through.

      0
      Reply
      Aaron
      Aaron
      2 years ago

      Reeeeally wish that the time that they go for a break didnt coincide with the time I do 95% of my workouts. Its a bot, it doesnt get tired

      5
      Reply
      Craig
      Craig
      2 years ago

      Saw some weird behaviour last night riding with B.Brevit. At one point I was ahead by just 15m and got reset back to 1.0x. Weird because that seems pretty close to the pace partner for the drops to reset. The other weird thing was that B.Brevit left the game. It was announced by B.Brevit saying “leaving in about two minutes…” but I thought they just roamed endlessly.

      0
      Reply
      Sussex Geezer
      Sussex Geezer
      2 years ago

      I joined Cara yesterday. At login set was
      to be on Tick Tock yet when I joined she was on the Hilly course which isn’t even shown as an option??

      1
      Reply
      Richard Braun
      Richard Braun
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Sussex Geezer

      Same here. As a ride, it was fine, but not expected.

      0
      Reply
      Marcus Upton
      Marcus Upton
      2 years ago

      Great idea, some routes were getting…well boring especially if flat, nice to be out the saddle more

      0
      Reply
      Craig P
      Craig P
      2 years ago

      Changing it up will be good imo! I do wish there was a way to warm up on the specific route for say 5-10 minutes and then the game automatically “jumps” you to the pacebot selected. I rarely will jump right in with one of the pacebots without a little warm up! Anyone else have that same need?

      4
      Reply
      MarkE
      MarkE
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Craig P

      I’ve found, at least with Coco, that I can pedal at 1.4-1.8 and keep up with the pack pretty well. Long enough to get a shortish warmup in to cruise at 2.5.

      0
      Reply
      Amy A
      Amy A
      2 years ago
      Reply to  MarkE

      So envious! I’m at 2.5-3 just to keep up. The imputed weight is a struggle since ‘she’ outweighs me by about 1/3 if what I have read is correct.

      OTOH, it makes me work harder some there’s that…

      0
      Reply
      MarkE
      MarkE
      2 years ago
      Reply to  Craig P

      But yes, being able to warm-up before joining would be great. It was easier on Tempus because you would quickly see them coming or overtaking you if you just selected the route and joined up.

      0
      Reply
      Mick Such
      Mick Such
      2 years ago

      Coco was doing Sand and Sequelias today – good for 3 laps. Seemed to be quite realistic n not too slow on the climbs from Desert and out of tunnel and had a respectful speed on the downhill.
      A good hard workout….. But maybe 2.25 instead of 2.5 would be better for Al of us Mon pro riders.

      0
      Reply
      Mattias Thyr
      Mattias Thyr
      2 years ago

      I have always wanted to be able to run pace with myself. think of following his avatar from last week’s round and adding 1% with a slider W or speed. and you choose according to the activity you drove s and which is saved on my personal computer.

      1
      Reply
      Christian D.
      Christian D.
      2 years ago

      👍

      0
      Reply
      Jules
      Jules
      2 years ago

      I enjoy the Pace Partners, but is there any way the C level ones could be a different colour to aid visibility? In large groups they merge into the dots on the map or get lost when “ride-ons” are being given out. I can’t believe that would be a tricky change for the team at Zwift and would make life easier for us as riders.

      5
      Reply
      electroRoss
      electroRoss
      2 years ago

      Glad to see some variety. Next up some bots paced half way between the current bots please.
      How do you name them though? Half Carafe, Decimal Dan?

      0
      Reply
      Marcus Eales
      Marcus Eales
      1 year ago

      I’m new to pace Parteners: to keep up with the green man I need to be warmed up (about ten minutes) what’s the best way to do this then join (other than stopping and restarting).

      0
      Reply
      Matt
      Matt
      1 year ago

      Why did the pace partner stop rotating? I figured it was because of the new year which may or may not make sense but we are far enough into the new year that some variation would be much loved?

      0
      Reply
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